Some thoughts on reparations

Published on June 22, 2005 By dharmagrl In Current Events

I read with interest that Wachovia Corp. has written a few paragraph letter of apology for it's subsidary companies part in slave-mongering back in the 1800's. Link

Apparently 2 banks that Wachovia bought have been shown to have accepted slaves as payment against default loans and allowed slaves to be used as collateral. Not Wachovia themselves, mind you, but companies that they bought out, long after the fact.

So, why did they write and issue the letter of apology?

To me, it seems like they were simply giving what they felt was needed, and that no real sincerity was behind it.

I don't blame them. Not in the slightest. No one working at that corporation today has directly dealt with or owned slaves, so they're really apologizing for what their ancestors, people who they're not even related to, did.

If my ancestors owned or purchased slaves, should I have to apologize for their actions? Would I apologize? I don't think that I should, and to be honest, no, I wouldn't. If my great grandfather was a rapist and a pedophile, would I be expected to constantly apologize for his actions? Is it my fault that he was a perverted bastard? No, it's not. Should I have to pay the descendants of his victims to placate them for his actions? I don't freakin' think so.

Much the same with slavery. I don't know if people are forgetting this, but it was commonplace at the time to own a slave. Much as it was commonplace a few decades ago to call people 'retards' and to think that a woman's place was at home, raising babies and keeping house. We have learned from the mistakes of the past, and we are not destined to repeat them.

This idea of a person paying for their ancestors mistakes is ridiculous. It simply perpetuates the idea that money solves everything.

Show me a person, a living person, who was enslaved, and I'll be happy to apologize to them. But to give money to their descendants, none of whom were enslaved and have never been directly affected by their ancestors slavery...to be honest, that smacks of a 'get rich quick' scheme to me.

Comments

ParaTed2k

on Jun 22, 2005

The people and corperations today have no more reason to apologize or make ammends to the Black people of America than the people of Missouri have to the Mormons today because of the Mormon Extermination Act.

We don't expect anything for the attrocities of the past, neither should they.

dharmagrl

on Jun 22, 2005

Exactly. I'm sure that if the majority of us went and look in our past, we could find some incident of our ancestors being wronged or harmed by another person that we could ask reparation for. However, were we to file civil suit against that person's descendants asking for reparations, we'd get laughed out of court.

Why is a black person asking for reparation because of an ancestor's slavery any different?

Dr Guy

on Jun 22, 2005

I think it is just as yo usay. They see dollar signs and figure they can get something for nothing. We even had a couple here try to claim a $500k slave reparation on their income taxes. The stupid thing is, one of them actually got the money before the IRS demanded it back.

bakerstreet

on Jun 22, 2005

The idea is that our 'ghettos' wouldn't be chocked full of people if it weren't for slavery. I think that is false, given all the poverty-ridden trailer parks full of white people, Hispanics, etc. around America.

I think this is not unlike the Senate apologizing for not making anti-lynching laws the other day. Unless you voted 'nay', there's absolutly no reason to apologize. It's sad that they play to stuff like this, because it makes people like Jackson and Sharpton more obnoxious and apt to play 'stiuck-em-up' with corporate America.

dharmagrl

on Jun 22, 2005

They see dollar signs and figure they can get something for nothing. We even had a couple here try to claim a $500k slave reparation on their income taxes.

What the fuck is wrong with people? What happened to earning your money, not riding on the coat tails of someone else's misfortunes??!

dharmagrl

on Jun 22, 2005

The idea is that our 'ghettos' wouldn't be chocked full of people if it weren't for slavery.

Give me a freakin' break. (not you personally, Baker, but the idea behind it). So, every person who is on welfare and living in poverty today is there because one of the distant relatives was enslaved? That's like my saying that I'm a criminal because my great great great great grandfather was a criminal.

My parents were poor. My husband's parents were poor. My husband and I decided that we didn't want to live like that, so we took the necessary actions to ensure that didn't happen. We didn't say "well, our ancestors all lived like this therefore we should too".

You're right, the point is invalid....there are plenty of poor white folks, poor hispanic folks, poor european folks.

mick_k

on Jun 22, 2005

My parents moved to Canada 25 years ago from Europe. They couldn't speak the language, and had little money. They could not stand to just live of welfare or live of others. Got any job they could, went to night school to learn the language. They lived within their means and never complained. Now they own a house, which is paid for, have a couple of cars and money saved up for retirement. They gave my brother and me a chance for a good life and sacrificed a great deal.

I have also met some people that live in the "ghetto" and I also noticed that alot of them (again at least the ones I met) seem to be there because of their own choices. They looked at the lifestyles of the rich and famous and felt that was owed to them. Spent their money on expensive clothes, ate at restaurants, would take a huge loan on a nice car and didn't feel like showing up to work after they were up all night drinking with the buddies. It was all about image and impressing others. So now they have nothing and blame everyone else except for the person that looks back at them in the mirror. Though even now they just blow their next check on that gold chain they just have to have.

During the 25 years my parents were here I can count the number of times they have eaten at a restaurant with the fingers on my hands. Sometime it just comes down to the choices you make.

MarcieMoo

on Jun 22, 2005

Well written, Karen. Well written, indeed.

dharmagrl

on Jun 22, 2005

They looked at the lifestyles of the rich and famous and felt that was owed to them.

And there's the problem. People feel like they're 'owed' something because of the past. I don't know if that attitude is one that's being handed down from generation to generation, or whether that's something that's new...but I do know that that is exactly what the issue is.

The thing is, the more reparations that are made, the more people will feel like they're entitled to something. The more we pander to this pressure, the more they see themselves as having 'won' and the more pressure they put on people and companies for monetary reparations. Apologies can be seen as admissions of guilt, and if we're guilty then.....well, we should pay.

Well written, Karen.

Thank you, Marcie.

bakerstreet

on Jun 22, 2005

Actually, if you look at history in detail you'll find that the 'ghetto' situation was caused mostly by many who actively sought freedom for slaves.

Have you ever noticed that a lot of towns have a 'bad side'? That can vary due to urban sprawl and economics, but originally it had a lot to do with planning.

When slaves were originally released, a lot of towns passed ordinances limiting where they could live, where they could work, etc. The idea was that forced integration was going to cause a lot of unrest and uneccesary conflict.

SO, the bleeding hearts thought it would be better to make little 'black suburbs' and the racists agreed since they didn't want to live near them. What resulted was a place with no jobs, no opportunity, and a lot of disgruntled poor people shoved in together.

When you hear "wrong side of the tracks" that is usually the original souce of the disctinction. They liked to put these suburbs on the other side of natural bariers, like railroads, rivers, etc.

Sorry to go off on a tangent. I just think a lot of the damage attributed to slavery was really caused by the lack of planning and understanding AFTER slavery was abolished.

MasonM

on Jun 22, 2005

Show me a person, a living person, who was enslaved, and I'll be happy to apologize to them.

Why? Did you personally own them or any other human being? Why would you want to apologize for what someone else did? I take responsibility for what I do, but I certainly don't accept any responsibility for what someone else did past or present.

Moderateman

on Jun 22, 2005

well I think reparations are in order, I am personally sueing the Egyptian government for back pay for building the pyramids>

MasonM

on Jun 22, 2005

well I think reparations are in order, I am personally sueing the Egyptian government for back pay for building the pyramids>

And such a good job you did too!
So how's that working for you?

dynamaso

on Jun 22, 2005

Yes, it would be as ridiculous as Irish-Australians suing the British for the hardships their ancestors endured while convicts. Sure, slavery (and the treatment of convicts, for that matter) wrote several terrible chapters in our history from which, I like to think, we've learnt and grown. I think in some respects, we've still got a long way to go, but the situation as you've described is nothing more than money-grubbing at its worst.

Great article, Dharma.

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